D&D 5E The Magical Martial

[Chaosmancer]

To explain anything beyond human ability, yes.

Okay. Can we explain anything beyond centaur ability? What about beyond Anthropomorphic Hippo ability?

Why is it that EVERYTHING is limited to human ability? Heck, Ogres are limited to human ability, they are only a measly 19 strength, that isn't even stronger than a human.

 

[Chaosmancer]

Replace humans with adventurers and we're good. Only adventurers get feats and can have classes and levels. NPCs and/or creatures (if human -- little "h") are exceptions, not the rule.

Humans (big "H") are not supernatural. It is the things they learn (magical), etc. that allows them to do supernatural things.

Humans are just... human.

To me, a distinction without a purpose. We don't say that Elves are no longer elves because they are adventurers, or that goblins are no longer goblins because they are adventurers.

And if we start saying that anyone with class levels, feats, class abilities, monster statblocks... are exceptions... then is that not just effort and opportunity? I can't perform surgery, it isn't because "Humans" are incapable of it and only "human doctors" are capable of it. If you don't want the commoners able to throw fire and leap tall buildings while carrying the family horse... just make it a matter of training, effort, and opportunity. Just like real-life.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Goody goody gumdrops for you.

Where does a Paladin's power come from? You will DEMAND it must be a god, the paladin must be empowered by a divine being. Nothing else makes sense to you, because otherwise, how can they do things humans cannot do?

Me? A paladin's power comes from the unshakeable convictions they have to their oath. That oath can be to a god, sure, but a paladin is someone who has bound their own soul with strictures that the universe itself cannot bend. And when you are in a fantasy world, and you have convictions that the gods themselves cannot bend, only accept or shatter, then that MEANS something. It grants you abilities beyond the petty limitations of flesh. How does that work? I don't know, how does love's first kiss break a curse, or a broken heart turn you into foam.

You can say "magic" but for DnD, Magic is spells. And I am fine making that distinction between spells and supernatural abilities fueled by the romantic ideals of the self moving the world. Of FANTASY.

It doesn't have to be a god, but it should be some entity or power source capable of granting supernatural abilities. Believing in something (anything according to the varied subclasses) really hard is just not one of those things.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Okay. Can we explain anything beyond centaur ability? What about beyond Anthropomorphic Hippo ability?

Why is it that EVERYTHING is limited to human ability? Heck, Ogres are limited to human ability, they are only a measly 19 strength, that isn't even stronger than a human.

It doesn't have to be limited to human ability, but humans are the only standard we have, and everything therefore has to deviate from that. I know a lot of folks want to pretend that isn't true, but...sorry, it is.

 

[CreamCloud0]

It doesn't have to be a god, but it should be some entity or power source capable of granting supernatural abilities. Believing in something (anything according to the varied subclasses) really hard is just not one of those things.

why do you get to tell everyone else that's not possible though?

and you might just say 'oh that's only my opinion of it, do what you want in your own games' but the fact you're perpetually insisting on all these things meeting the Micah Sweet standard of believability before we can discuss anything else basically means you are telling us how our games should be played.

 

[Micah Sweet]

why do you get to tell everyone else that's not possible though?

and you might just say 'oh that's only my opinion of it, do what you want in your own games' but the fact you're perpetually insisting on all these things meeting the Micah Sweet standard of believability before we can discuss anything else basically means you are telling us how our games should be played.

People keep telling me that *everything here is just subjective opinion, so calling that out in every post isn't necessary. I'm just trying to get on board with the majority. You can of course do what you want, but the above is my take on believability and what I want out of a game. I'm not stopping anyone from actually making up new abilities, just being clear about what I would want out of them.

 

[Chaosmancer]

It doesn't have to be a god, but it should be some entity or power source capable of granting supernatural abilities. Believing in something (anything according to the varied subclasses) really hard is just not one of those things.

And you are wrong, because plenty of Fantasy does EXACTLY that. So, you are demanding that your explanation that you like is front and center and forced on everyone, and cannot accept that we could be vague and let everyone's explanation be okay.

Because it isn't good enough for you, and you will not leave us alone to discuss anything until it is good enough for you.

 

[Chaosmancer]

It doesn't have to be limited to human ability, but humans are the only standard we have, and everything therefore has to deviate from that. I know a lot of folks want to pretend that isn't true, but...sorry, it is.

Funny, because plenty of other fantasy shows us other standards. And that standard is "more than human" but when it comes to DnD, you insist that it must be the human standard and nothing else, despite 41 other options.

Because for you humans are the default. For you they must be earth humans. For you they have to be the most numerous. For you they must be the standard everything is limited by.

 

[Chaosmancer]

People keep telling me that *everything here is just subjective opinion, so calling that out in every post isn't necessary. I'm just trying to get on board with the majority. You can of course do what you want, but the above is my take on believability and what I want out of a game. I'm not stopping anyone from actually making up new abilities, just being clear about what I would want out of them.

Great we've heard you. We've known what you want for OVER A HUNDRED PAGES. None of us want to sit here and rewrite the PHB for you. Your opinion is known, written in stone, and three years from now I will probably still be able to tell people what Micah Sweet wants from a fighter ability that goes beyond what a gym-bro can do.

WE KNOW WHAT YOU WANT!

 

[Gammadoodler]

Great we've heard you. We've known what you want for OVER A HUNDRED PAGES. None of us want to sit here and rewrite the PHB for you. Your opinion is known, written in stone, and three years from now I will probably still be able to tell people what Micah Sweet wants from a fighter ability that goes beyond what a gym-bro can do.

WE KNOW WHAT YOU WANT!

In fairness.. what Micah Sweet wants is explicit license for such fighters to be fantastic before giving them fantastic abilities.

It does not appear that they care overmuch whether those abilities are provided if that license is given.

Do I think this is a needlessly litigious way to go about things in the context of a fantasy roleplaying game, when such license could (and IMO should) very easily be inferred.?

Yes. Absolutely.

But I don't think it's fair to characterize the objection as having a problem with supernatural abilities themselves.