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D&D 3E/3.5 Illusions in 3.5
- Thread starter Elvinis75
- Start date
Zhure
First Post
PHB, page 158.
On that one page in 3e, it covers pretty much everything covered in 1e and 2e, by breaking the illusions down into types of illusions and how they can interact in the real world.
In some respects, illusions have been very much stratified compared to 1e and 2e. In some 1e/2e campaigns, I've seen Phantasmal force used to a greater effect than fireballs, even though it's a lower level spell. The sheer flexibility of illusions makes them powerful, giving gratis damage to a failed save as was done in earlier editions just exacerbates the relatively low level of the spell.
To quote from the SRD:
"Illusion
Illusion spells deceive the senses or minds of others. They cause people to see things that are not there, not see things that are there, hear phantom noises, or remember things that never happened. Illusions come in five types: figments, glamers, patterns, phantasms, and shadows.
Figment: A figment spell creates a false sensation. Those who perceive the figment perceive the same thing, not their own slightly different versions of the figment. (It is not a personalized mental impression.) Figments cannot make something seem to be something else. A figment that includes audible effects cannot duplicate intelligible speech unless the spell description specifically says it can. If intelligible speech is possible, it must be in a language the character can speak. If the character tries to duplicate a language the character cannot speak, the image produces gibberish. Likewise, the character cannot make a visual copy of something unless the character knows what it looks like.
Because figments and glamers (see below) are unreal, they cannot produce real effects the way that other types of illusions can. They cannot cause damage to objects or creatures, support weight, provide nutrition, illuminate darkness, or provide protection from the elements. Consequently, these spells are useful for confounding or delaying foes, but useless for attacking them directly.
Glamer: A glamer spell changes a subject's sensory qualities, making it look, feel, taste, smell, or sound like something else, or even seem to disappear.
Pattern: Like a figment, a pattern spell creates an image that others can see, but a pattern also affects the minds of those who see it or are caught in it. All patterns are mind-affecting spells.
Phantasm: A phantasm spell creates a mental image that usually only the caster and the subject (or subjects) of the spell can perceive. This impression is totally in the minds of the subjects. It is a personalized mental impression. (It's all in their heads and not a fake picture or something that they actually see.) Third parties viewing or studying the scene don't notice the phantasm at all. All phantasms are mind-affecting spells.
Shadow: A shadow spell creates something that is partially real (quasi-real). The caster weaves it from extradimensional energies. Such illusions can have real effects. If a creature takes damage from a shadow illusion, that damage is real.
Saving Throws and Illusions (Disbelief): Creatures encountering an illusion effect usually do not receive saving throws to recognize it as illusory until they study it carefully or interact with it in some fashion.
A successful saving throw against an illusion reveals it to be false, but a figment or phantasm remains as a translucent outline.
A failed saving throw indicates that a character fails to notice something is amiss. A character faced with incontrovertible proof that an illusion isn't real needs no saving throw. If any viewer successfully disbelieves an illusion and communicates this fact to other viewers, each such viewer gains a saving throw with a +4 bonus."
On that one page in 3e, it covers pretty much everything covered in 1e and 2e, by breaking the illusions down into types of illusions and how they can interact in the real world.
In some respects, illusions have been very much stratified compared to 1e and 2e. In some 1e/2e campaigns, I've seen Phantasmal force used to a greater effect than fireballs, even though it's a lower level spell. The sheer flexibility of illusions makes them powerful, giving gratis damage to a failed save as was done in earlier editions just exacerbates the relatively low level of the spell.
To quote from the SRD:
"Illusion
Illusion spells deceive the senses or minds of others. They cause people to see things that are not there, not see things that are there, hear phantom noises, or remember things that never happened. Illusions come in five types: figments, glamers, patterns, phantasms, and shadows.
Figment: A figment spell creates a false sensation. Those who perceive the figment perceive the same thing, not their own slightly different versions of the figment. (It is not a personalized mental impression.) Figments cannot make something seem to be something else. A figment that includes audible effects cannot duplicate intelligible speech unless the spell description specifically says it can. If intelligible speech is possible, it must be in a language the character can speak. If the character tries to duplicate a language the character cannot speak, the image produces gibberish. Likewise, the character cannot make a visual copy of something unless the character knows what it looks like.
Because figments and glamers (see below) are unreal, they cannot produce real effects the way that other types of illusions can. They cannot cause damage to objects or creatures, support weight, provide nutrition, illuminate darkness, or provide protection from the elements. Consequently, these spells are useful for confounding or delaying foes, but useless for attacking them directly.
Glamer: A glamer spell changes a subject's sensory qualities, making it look, feel, taste, smell, or sound like something else, or even seem to disappear.
Pattern: Like a figment, a pattern spell creates an image that others can see, but a pattern also affects the minds of those who see it or are caught in it. All patterns are mind-affecting spells.
Phantasm: A phantasm spell creates a mental image that usually only the caster and the subject (or subjects) of the spell can perceive. This impression is totally in the minds of the subjects. It is a personalized mental impression. (It's all in their heads and not a fake picture or something that they actually see.) Third parties viewing or studying the scene don't notice the phantasm at all. All phantasms are mind-affecting spells.
Shadow: A shadow spell creates something that is partially real (quasi-real). The caster weaves it from extradimensional energies. Such illusions can have real effects. If a creature takes damage from a shadow illusion, that damage is real.
Saving Throws and Illusions (Disbelief): Creatures encountering an illusion effect usually do not receive saving throws to recognize it as illusory until they study it carefully or interact with it in some fashion.
A successful saving throw against an illusion reveals it to be false, but a figment or phantasm remains as a translucent outline.
A failed saving throw indicates that a character fails to notice something is amiss. A character faced with incontrovertible proof that an illusion isn't real needs no saving throw. If any viewer successfully disbelieves an illusion and communicates this fact to other viewers, each such viewer gains a saving throw with a +4 bonus."
Although this page gives a good description of what each of the types of illusion is possible of doing in the general sense it doesn't give good examples.
Can an illusionist create a monster with silent image that attacks the opponents?
What about minor image?
What about major image?
Can I create a copy of myself that attacks the opponent also?
What about a dragon that swoops in and breathes fire?
What about a block of stone that crushes them?
Can an illusionist create a monster with silent image that attacks the opponents?
What about minor image?
What about major image?
Can I create a copy of myself that attacks the opponent also?
What about a dragon that swoops in and breathes fire?
What about a block of stone that crushes them?
niteshade6
First Post
You can try to do any of that with an illusion, although some will be more believable then others. A silent image monster will be quickly realized to be fake because it has no sound or tactile illusion. A major image could easily fool somebody even in combat with it, unless they make their save. Though they might get suspicious that they are never getting hit for damage by it if they fight for awhile.
The important thing to remember, is to forget everything from previous editions. Illusions are just that. They don't do damage any more, not even fake damage. Crushing somebody with a block of illusionary stone won't do much more then scare them for a second and perhaps obscure some vision.
The important thing to remember, is to forget everything from previous editions. Illusions are just that. They don't do damage any more, not even fake damage. Crushing somebody with a block of illusionary stone won't do much more then scare them for a second and perhaps obscure some vision.
Whaa!!!
No more fake damage?
Hmm... well that pretty much stinks.
That makes it hard to make the whole creature attacking them work. Tell me again about the rabbits?!? What about a major image that looks like a fireball? No fake damage? What is the use? Tell me some cool ways to use illusions to defeat enemies then please? I'm more of a 2E illusions person and need help in making the transition.
No more fake damage?
Hmm... well that pretty much stinks.
That makes it hard to make the whole creature attacking them work. Tell me again about the rabbits?!? What about a major image that looks like a fireball? No fake damage? What is the use? Tell me some cool ways to use illusions to defeat enemies then please? I'm more of a 2E illusions person and need help in making the transition.
Re: Whaa!!!
"Fake damage" has been replaced by the Shadow spells-- shadow evocation, shadow conjuration, shades, etc. They're illusion spells that are also partly real. Against someone who fails his Will save, they have full normal effect-- a shadow fireball deals just as much fire damage as the real thing. Against targets who disbelieve, they do much less damage (only 20% of normal IIRC). Either way, it's real damage that can actually kill.
"Fake damage" has been replaced by the Shadow spells-- shadow evocation, shadow conjuration, shades, etc. They're illusion spells that are also partly real. Against someone who fails his Will save, they have full normal effect-- a shadow fireball deals just as much fire damage as the real thing. Against targets who disbelieve, they do much less damage (only 20% of normal IIRC). Either way, it's real damage that can actually kill.
