D&D (2024) Greyhawk Confirmed. Tell Me Why.

[AstroCat]

Ok whatever, disagreeing about what? Also lots of adventure paths and modules set in GH, plus all the fan content active to this day. Read a setting book if you want to learn more about the differences between FR and GH. Oh I don’t put it passed wotc to have zero explanation for anything added or changed to GH, that is popular thing to do with IPs lately, it’s easier for them. I’m off to play some D&D, in a setting with a lot cool lore.

 

[TiQuinn]

Ok whatever, disagreeing about what? Read a book if you want to learn more about the differences between FR and GH. Oh I don’t put it passed wotc to have zero explanation for anything added or changed to GH, that is popular thing to do with IPs lately, it’s easier for them. I’m off to play some D&D, in a setting with a lot cool lore.

So you’re saying you have to drop a lore bomb or we have to read a book to explain the difference between FR and GH?

I’m pretty sure I can describe the differences between FR, Ravenloft, Spelljammer, Planescape and others fairly easily. Maybe there’s a reason there’s a struggle for Greyhawk?

 

[Remathilis]

You are missing my point. Actually there aren't "plenty of books" out there that cover Greyhawk. What there actually are is a couple of folios, a shopping list of Dragon articles and a lengthy list of adventures set in Greyhawk. Books? Not so much.

So, again, my point stands here. GH has been mined so heavily by Forgotten Realms and the fact that both settings rely on the same sources - the PHB and the Monster Manual - for much of the setting elements, that of course there are some serious overlaps. What makes GH stand out from FR though is the lack of large meta-plots and the lack of specific material detailing the setting. GH is a much less detailed setting than FR. By a lot. Which makes GH a much better setting (IMO) for homebrewers and those who want to make the setting their own. Who were the last fifteen mayors of Saltmarsh? Who knows? Who cares? If I want that level of detail, I have Forgotten Realms. In GH, if I want that level of detail, I make it up myself.

It's the weird reason while the species deities (Moradin, Correlon, etc) exist officially in GH and FR, but no other setting. Or while KotB and Blackmoor are both part of the Flanaess and Known World of Mystara. Much of the early D&D stuff was supposed to exist in ALL D&D settings, it isn't until Dragonlance where the idea that official settings exclude things from the core books becomes a thing.

 

[AstroCat]

So you’re saying you have to drop a lore bomb or we have to read a book to explain the difference between FR and GH?

I’m pretty sure I can describe the differences between FR, Ravenloft, Spelljammer, Planescape and others fairly easily. Maybe there’s a reason there’s a struggle for Greyhawk?

I’m saying I’m not here to make a long list of differences between GH and other settings for you, do your own homework. Sounds like you believe there aren’t any and thus the setting would be pretty worthless since all other settings cover all it does. I disagree but you got it all figured out so whatever and it is amazing the setting still survives to this day since it’s so lame by your standards. And why the heck would there be all those fan projects if the setting is so worthless? I think because it is a cool setting with its own identity and plenty of cool and interesting elements along with a fun sword and sorcery vibe.

 

[Remathilis]

I’m saying I’m not here to make a long list of differences between GH and other settings for you, do your own homework. Sounds like you believe there aren’t any and thus the setting would be pretty worthless since all other settings cover all it does. I disagree but you got it all figured out so whatever and it is amazing the setting still survives to this day since it’s so lame by your standards. And why the heck would there be all those fan projects if the setting is so worthless?

To me, the difference has always been vanilla vs French vanilla. There is a difference in taste and color, but for a lot of people the difference is minimal, and both work equally well for any place vanilla ice cream is called for. Yes, there is a difference, but the difference isn't big enough to make a big deal about unless you are a true ice cream snob.

 

[MNblockhead]

To me, the difference has always been vanilla vs French vanilla. There is a difference in taste and color, but for a lot of people the difference is minimal, and both work equally well for any place vanilla ice cream is called for. Yes, there is a difference, but the difference isn't big enough to make a big deal about unless you are a true ice cream snob.

Greyhawk is vanilla bean--the gritty vanilla ice cream!

 

[Remathilis]

Greyhawk is vanilla bean--the gritty vanilla ice cream!

Planescape is Neopolitian. Ravenloft is strawberry swirl (at least I hope it's strawberry) and Dragonlance is artisanal vanilla. Eberron is frozen custard.

No I will not explain or expand on this metaphor any further.

 

[TiQuinn]

I’m saying I’m not here to make a long list of differences between GH and other settings for you, do your own homework. Sounds like you believe there aren’t any and thus the setting would be pretty worthless since all other settings cover all it does. I disagree but you got it all figured out so whatever and it is amazing the setting still survives to this day since it’s so lame by your standards.

Oh, I can tell you why it still survives to this day - it was Gary Gygax’s. That mystique alone assured people would be enamored with it.

Do I think it’s worthless? I think it’s under-developed. It’s got a great map. It’s got a lot of places with silly names. It’s got a lot of very famous NPCs who are complete tabula rasas in terms of personality. I think if you want the barest starting point of a campaign setting with no one having preconceived notions of what’s there - Greyhawk is perfect. No one’s gonna ask you about Elminster or Drizzt. No ones gonna question a DM based on a contradictory point in a novel.

 

[AstroCat]

To me, the difference has always been vanilla vs French vanilla. There is a difference in taste and color, but for a lot of people the difference is minimal, and both work equally well for any place vanilla ice cream is called for. Yes, there is a difference, but the difference isn't big enough to make a big deal about unless you are a true ice cream snob.

I feel there is a huge difference between FR and GH, the whole vibe is so different for me. I don’t really like the over the top HF of FR, but really enjoy the more old school gritty S&S vibe of GH. For me the difference is big. I’ll play FR but when I run it I tone it down. Also never realized there was such GH “hate” floating around, glad I’ve avoided for so long.

 

[Parmandur]

To me, the difference has always been vanilla vs French vanilla. There is a difference in taste and color, but for a lot of people the difference is minimal, and both work equally well for any place vanilla ice cream is called for. Yes, there is a difference, but the difference isn't big enough to make a big deal about unless you are a true ice cream snob.

I'd say Greyhawk is vanilla ice cream, while the FR is a vanilla layer cake: similar ingredients, very different mix.