Class Tiers and Character Builds in a Featless & Multiclassless game

[squibbles]

Hi all,

I'm enthusiastic about the ranking threads that have been started in this forum of late.

However, I am currently playing in a featless and multiclassless game, which makes several of the builds under discussion, i.e. the -5/+10 jam, considerably less relevant.

For those of you playing in similar games and/or those of you who are maths-savvy and inclined to browbeat your lessers, what classes and subclasses do you think would flourish in such a game?

Additionally, what sweet but novel/clever/unintuitive builds have you theorycrafted and/or stumbled upon? (constrained as you are)

Thanks!

 

[The Crimson Binome]

In my experience, fighters don't do as well, but casters are just as strong either way.

The real winners are the classes which benefit strongly from having multiple high stats. Monks and paladins both shine here, since they continue to benefit from maxing out their secondary abilities, where SAD classes fail to improve much after their one good stat hits 20.

 

[Zardnaar]

Monks, Paladins, Hunter Rangers, Warlocks look a lot better. Apart from that the rankings don't change much except fighters are a bit worse.

 

[S'mon]

I've played 1-20 featless & multiclassless. I'd say it favours full casters like Clerics & Wizards over Rogues & Fighters. Though everyone is still viable.

 

[Krachek]

SAD classes can reach 20 in constitution.
It just make the wizard have more hit points than the paladin with 20 str, 20 charisma.
In the actual game, it is not so bad.

 

[Krachek]

I think it make a more balance game.
Optimize combo run SS or GWM for martial.
Caster run combo around MC sorcerer-warlock-paladin.
Without them everyone get leveled.

 

[Coroc]

Feat and mc less according to my experience bear totem barbarian and dragon sorcerer are very strong
One as a tank who can also dish out some pain the other as a damagedealer

 

[Lolek Bolinky]

Any multiclassing between warrior and rogue is pretty imba these days. Let me know what you think.

 

[squibbles]

I've played 1-20 featless & multiclassless. I'd say it favours full casters like Clerics & Wizards over Rogues & Fighters. Though everyone is still viable.

Yeah, this has been my experience.

It feels considerably more limiting to play a martial class without feats/multiclassing than it does to play a full caster. I know that wizards and clerics benefit significantly from warcaster and resilient(Con), but I don't feel like losing those feats detracts from their ability to do cool stuff in the way that losing access to GWM, SS, PAM, sentinel, crossbow expert, mobile, etc. hurts martials.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

I actually do think that not being able to get better con saves hinders a caster a lot. So my guess top rank caster classes are:
- transmuter wizards (transmuter stone prodiciency)
- sorcerer (natural con proficiency though lacking wissom saving throws)
- diviner wizard (2 get out of jails per day)
- clerics (good armor and bless)

Martial classes who benefit most from stats:
- monk
- barbarian (good saves. Berserker gets a special mention because without feats you can frenzy for an extra attack and immunity to charm and fear)
- fighter (20 str and 20 dex and high con are possible, or even 20 wisdom to have good perception and wis saves)
- rogue: free wisdom save (but very late)

Special mention for the valor bard who gets a good package of ac and spellcasting and also being able to give saving throw bonuses to everyone.

Also if you expect to get to level 12 you can more easily justify not to start with 16 in main stat so you can pair some races for secondary benfits:

- dwarven wizard for a lot better AC.
- Wood elf wizard to easily advance to level 4 because of your speed, stealthiness and bow proficiency
- halfling wizard for lucky and stealth
- gnome bear totem barbarian to get either proficiency or advantage to all saves and resistance to nearly all damage.

So after writing it out I have to say: there are so many possibilities without touching feats or multiclass and so many useful combinations that it is hard to rate them.