It's also damage that is part of the class outside of the feature in question. Saying Rage damage should count towards Frenzy's total is like saying maneuver damage should count toward the extra attacks from Action Surge, because the attacks the superiority dice were applied to wouldn't have happened without Action Surge.
Hmmm. We seem to be crossing signals here.
If normally I do 2 attacks, adding Str and rage to each one, then I get to make a 3rd attack because of Frenzy, I add rage and Str to that attack. So base class does 2 * (weapon damage + rage + str) and Frenzy adds an addition (weapon damage + rage + str). Yes, the rage damage is a class feature, but you only get 2 of them without the subclass feature.
Martial Arts, Flurry of Blows, Two-Weapon Fighting, War Priest, Quickened Firebolt, Spiritual Weapon. And that's just non-feat granted attacks. Other impactful features also make use of this resource the Frenzy Barb is giving up.
Ah, I thought you mean lots of ways for
barbarians, presumably of other subclasses, to get a bonus attack. I'm not sure why you think all those other classes are relevant to this discussion. If you want to pick one and model how much their level 3 subclass ability is worth, I'm all ears.
Also, why don't feats count again? After all, that's kind of an important point. The bonus action frenzy uses is such a drawback because now GWM grants Fighters and such a free attack when it procs, but Barbarians don't because they already spent it.
Because there's an opportunity cost for Feats. That is, if you don't take GWM because you already have a bonus attack (but see below) then you get to take something else. And how do you compare, say, Mobile, with GWM?
That said, I think GWM with Frenzy is still mostly ok. The bonus attack of Frenzy occurs
mostly against mooks. So don't waste Frenzy on those fights. Sure, sometimes (about 1/10, assuming Reckless Attacks) you'll crit, C'est la vie. But if you're using Reckless you'll often (not always) use the -5/+10, so GWM will shine anyway.
You criticized the Fighter for "running out of gas" after a few rounds, but a character who is "out of gas" will perform the same as a character who has resources left but refuses to use them. It's not even about judging. If you face that gauntlet of encounters, even if you only use your frenzy on the last one, the Fighter could take no short rests, foolishly refuse to make use of his abilities until you frenzy, and still outperform the Barbarian in every fight except the last, and keep up for the first few rounds of the last.
I wasn't "criticizing" it so much as commenting that the numbers you quote only work for a few rounds, then he's a normal fighter again (which is still pretty darned good).
But, sure. Different classes/subclasses/builds shine at different things. The Battlemaster build is great for a few rounds once per short rest. Not arguing with that.
Frenzy just isn't like Superiority Dice. It's not an easy way to sprinkle extra damage (with some additional benefits) here and there. Yes, mistiming it carries some risk. But if you time it right it's freaking awesome.
Anyway, about to drive 1,000 miles. Catch you all on the flipside.
