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Monks Are Not Tanks And Shouldn’t Be
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<blockquote data-quote="Chaosmancer" data-source="post: 9073986" data-attributes="member: 6801228"><p>Okay, let us say you are correct about 4e, and there was no possible way to build a fighter who relied on Wisdom or something. </p><p></p><p>Can you build a straight paladin in 5e and dump strength and attack with Charisma? No. You can't. And you literally just stated that in 3e it would be dumping their combat stats. So the phenomena you are proposing ONLY happened in 4e. </p><p></p><p>But, here is an odd thought, is 4e representing that the Lil Suzy the Waif is bad at fighting and Lil Timmy the Fighter is good at it? Not really. Using Strength doesn't mean much. Barbarians use strength in 4e, and they are boosted by primal magics. Warlords use strength in 4e and they aren't supposed to be as good of warriors, right? And actually, is the 4e fighter a good warrior because they deal damage? Because if that is the case, then the Rogue and the Ranger are the superior warriors, and neither of them use strength (maybe the rogue thug does? I don't remember) </p><p></p><p>So, you are trying to state something that happened in 4e, make it apply retroactively to 3.X and claim it applies to 5e. And it doesn't even follow that it is true in 4e. </p><p></p><p></p><p>Again, here is a character's combat abilities at level 5</p><p></p><p>Extra Attack</p><p>Dueling Fighting Style</p><p>Proficiency in All Armor and All Weapons</p><p>A 1st level feat and a 4th level feat. </p><p></p><p>Am I describing a fighter or a paladin? Could even be a Battlesmith Artificer who took a feat with their racial ability. You are trying to draw a bright line here and say "Paladins are worse in combat because they rely on divine power" but the MECHANICS disagree with you. Yes, Paladins have divine Power and Fighter's don't. But that doesn't mean fighter's are BETTER at fighting. It is a false conclusion.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Chaosmancer, post: 9073986, member: 6801228"] Okay, let us say you are correct about 4e, and there was no possible way to build a fighter who relied on Wisdom or something. Can you build a straight paladin in 5e and dump strength and attack with Charisma? No. You can't. And you literally just stated that in 3e it would be dumping their combat stats. So the phenomena you are proposing ONLY happened in 4e. But, here is an odd thought, is 4e representing that the Lil Suzy the Waif is bad at fighting and Lil Timmy the Fighter is good at it? Not really. Using Strength doesn't mean much. Barbarians use strength in 4e, and they are boosted by primal magics. Warlords use strength in 4e and they aren't supposed to be as good of warriors, right? And actually, is the 4e fighter a good warrior because they deal damage? Because if that is the case, then the Rogue and the Ranger are the superior warriors, and neither of them use strength (maybe the rogue thug does? I don't remember) So, you are trying to state something that happened in 4e, make it apply retroactively to 3.X and claim it applies to 5e. And it doesn't even follow that it is true in 4e. Again, here is a character's combat abilities at level 5 Extra Attack Dueling Fighting Style Proficiency in All Armor and All Weapons A 1st level feat and a 4th level feat. Am I describing a fighter or a paladin? Could even be a Battlesmith Artificer who took a feat with their racial ability. You are trying to draw a bright line here and say "Paladins are worse in combat because they rely on divine power" but the MECHANICS disagree with you. Yes, Paladins have divine Power and Fighter's don't. But that doesn't mean fighter's are BETTER at fighting. It is a false conclusion. [/QUOTE]
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