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<blockquote data-quote="James Gasik" data-source="post: 8568188" data-attributes="member: 6877472"><p>Yeah but the ability to take unlimited levels is kind of a wash. I think the vast majority of games never reached those levels, and what good does unlimited advancement do you if you can't survive to reach those levels?</p><p></p><p>Thieves did not have all that much greater survivability than Mages, when you get right down to it, and until they reach a decent level, probably less utility. Take for example, opening a lock. You're not going to get 95% chance to do that before 4th level most likely (at least, not without a Kit or a Dexterity score higher than 16).</p><p></p><p>Sure, it's better than using a spell slot on Knock, or asking the strong guy in the party to use his Open Doors (or Bend Bars/Lift Gates, depending on what's being unlocked) on it. Or just bashing it with a hammer or pouring acid in the lock. Find/Remove Traps, another Ability you should be prioritizing, is in the same boat.</p><p></p><p>That means you've spent all your points in these areas. Climb Walls, at least, generally starts high. But you'll probably want Detect Noise, and this is all before you can even think about "skulking about to backstab"!</p><p></p><p>Read Languages could be a good substitute for Comprehend Languages, but who has the points for that?</p><p></p><p>Which leaves us with Pick Pockets, which generally just annoys DM's anyways when you hit town and try to get rich quick, lol (though I did once beat a Lich by managing to steal his spell components, that was fun).</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="James Gasik, post: 8568188, member: 6877472"] Yeah but the ability to take unlimited levels is kind of a wash. I think the vast majority of games never reached those levels, and what good does unlimited advancement do you if you can't survive to reach those levels? Thieves did not have all that much greater survivability than Mages, when you get right down to it, and until they reach a decent level, probably less utility. Take for example, opening a lock. You're not going to get 95% chance to do that before 4th level most likely (at least, not without a Kit or a Dexterity score higher than 16). Sure, it's better than using a spell slot on Knock, or asking the strong guy in the party to use his Open Doors (or Bend Bars/Lift Gates, depending on what's being unlocked) on it. Or just bashing it with a hammer or pouring acid in the lock. Find/Remove Traps, another Ability you should be prioritizing, is in the same boat. That means you've spent all your points in these areas. Climb Walls, at least, generally starts high. But you'll probably want Detect Noise, and this is all before you can even think about "skulking about to backstab"! Read Languages could be a good substitute for Comprehend Languages, but who has the points for that? Which leaves us with Pick Pockets, which generally just annoys DM's anyways when you hit town and try to get rich quick, lol (though I did once beat a Lich by managing to steal his spell components, that was fun). [/QUOTE]
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