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D&D (2024) GenCon 2023 - D&D Rules Revision panel

Clint_L

Legend
Basically the 2014 Barbarian, Ranger, Sorcerer, and Champion Fighter are so bad with XGTE and TCOE, even the bad playtest versions are better.
Or, maybe, other people like things that you don't. A wise person one posted that "~50% of D&D hardcore fans are selfish and only want D&D to be really their way."
 

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Clint_L

Legend
It's true.
4e was a success. It made a ton of money.
Define "ton" - for example, the recent film The Flash made a ton of money at the box office...unfortunately, not nearly enough to cover what it cost to produce.
It just didn't make the amount of money WOTC wanted, spawned competitors, and the designers were running out of ideas.
This is an unusual definition of "success."
 

Minigiant

Legend
Supporter
Or, maybe, other people like things that you don't. A wise person one posted that "~50% of D&D hardcore fans are selfish and only want D&D to be really their way."

1691262307547.png

It aint my opinion.

I'm like one of the least selfish D&D fan on here. I want D&D to be designed for everyone.
Part of that is recognizing people are different.
 

Minigiant

Legend
Supporter
So, any news come out of the panel, or are we looking at some 9odd pages here of people arguing over word choice and statistics?
PHB
The low satisfaction classes and subclasses will be redesigned

MM
More high level monsters
Boring monsters with get spice

DMG
DMG will actually guide DMs and not just be a conversion book for old DMs..
DMG will come with a full setting
 

Clint_L

Legend

View attachment 291772
It aint my opinion.

I'm like one of the least selfish D&D fan on here. I want D&D to be designed for everyone.
Part of that is recognizing people are different.
Okay...so why are you assuming the updated versions are only scoring highly because "Basically the 2014 Barbarian, Ranger, Sorcerer, and Champion Fighter are so bad with XGTE and TCOE, even the bad playtest versions are better"? That...seems a lot like your opinion.

Maybe, just maybe, the playtest versions are scoring highly because they are really good and other people like things that you don't. Or is that not a permissible way to interpret the chart?
 


mamba

Legend
4e also proves the point about WOTC not having any conviction in their own ideas.
the playtest shows that to me already, was not around for 4e

I believe it was here that I read an anecdote about WOTC staff being flabbergasted at the thought someone actually liked 4e; even if you're accepting that your game isn't liked by the masses, to react with incredulity rather than gratitude when you meet someone who does like it is very indicative.
that is probably just a matter of knowing the odds, not a reflection on how they thought about anything in particular
 

Minigiant

Legend
Supporter
Okay...so why are you assuming the updated versions are bad and only scoring highly because "Basically the 2014 Barbarian, Ranger, Sorcerer, and Champion Fighter are so bad with XGTE and TCOE, even the bad playtest versions are better"?

Maybe, just maybe, they are scoring highly because other people like things that you don't. Or is that not a permissible way to interpret the chart?

I think the updated UA4 Ranger, UA5 Fighter and Sorcerer are still bad.
I didn't say they weren't better.
They are better.
The rating when up when it used to be very low. And the survey aint just me.
WOTC's own words is that ratings below 60% are terrible. So the 2019 version are terrible. It's not hard for a pro designer to design better than a known terrible product.
 


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